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Episode 212: The bad hotel
30th October, 2026 • James Smales, Jonny Robins and John Cantrell from 'Here's What You Do' face questions about delicate decorum, bumper beef and tanker transport.
Transcription by Caption+
Tom:
In 2011, why did a Hall of Fame put 15 pounds of beef jerky on display? The answer to that at the end of the show. My name's Tom Scott, and this is Lateral. And now it's time for the quizzing forecast issued by the Lateral Office of Mild Confusion at 1700 hours. Curiosity, rising steadily throughout the episode. Speculation, occasional bursts easing from the west. Confidence, initially calm but becoming patchy later on. Across most of the studio, we expect light theories, some scattered guesses, and the chance of a sudden realisation moving in from the east. Later, outbreaks of enthusiastic wrong answer are likely, followed by clearing conditions as the explanation arrives. A system of three visiting thinkers is moving into the studio. It's the gang from the quiz podcast Here's What You Do!
SFX:
(guests laughing)
Jonny:
Yeah!
John:
I love that. That was amazing!
Tom:
That reference is gonna be lost on so many of the audience.
Jonny:
And most of us.
John:
It was great.
James:
Tom, we're normally more associated with blunderstorms.
Tom:
Eyy!
John:
Oh. Delightful, that.
James:
(laughs)
Tom:
I need a different response to a pun than sounding like the Fonz. I've noticed myself start to do that. And I just need to— I need something different. But the only other acceptable thing I've got is just a polite golf clap, and that just seems patronising. You know? That's...
John:
No, no, yeah. Stick with the wahey. That's much better.
Tom:
Welcome back to the show. You are quiz writers yourselves one way or another. Tell me about Here's What You Do. 'Cause you should plug the show. Jonny, you should start.
Jonny:
So, Here's What You Do is a weekly podcast where we all set each other a new quiz every week. So we all come up with a new quiz format and test it out on each other.
Tom:
And James, are we talking different questions here, or are we talking whole different formats?
James:
Yeah, it's a completely new thing each time. So it might be a word quiz. It could be a quiz that's got mistakes in it, and you've got to spot what that is. It's not just simply, "What's the capital of France?" Although we may ask that. It's always how it's packaged and how the quiz is written.
Tom:
And John, you've got experience writing quizzes for Here's What You Do. The other two have some experience with TV shows in general?
John:
They do indeed. Both of them have been working in TV for a long time. Jim's done thing like he developed Lingo. Jonny's worked on 007: A Road to a Million and various other things, and I also... attend the podcasts.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Tom:
I'd like to think that for the first time – I think this is your fourth appearance – we actually teed everything up there smoothly. I think that worked.
Jonny:
Finally.
Tom:
Well done, chaps.
John:
Magical.
James:
We should come better prepared.
Tom:
Let's see if you can forecast the answer to question one.
James:
Oh—! (claps)
John:
(blurts laugh)
Tom:
Thank you to Chris Howlett for this question. In 1928, a patron of a Chicago bar suddenly ordered and ate 13 sandwiches, then left disappointed. Why? I'll say that again. In 1928, a patron of a Chicago bar suddenly ordered and ate 13 sandwiches, then left disappointed. Why?
James:
Sometimes you just need 14 sandwiches, don't you?
SFX:
(others laughing)
James:
And when you... order and eat 13, it just doesn't hit the spot.
Tom:
(laughs)
John:
Did he— Was it, like, a Russian Roulette of sandwiches, and he said, "You know, just— I'll take what comes and keep my fingers crossed one of these is ham on rye," but it didn't turn up?
Jonny:
But then 13 sandwiches, no one's eating 13 regular-size sandwiches, are they? Unless they're doing some—
John:
You've not seen me go, Jonny.
Jonny:
(laughs)
James:
I wonder if it was a competition of sorts. A bit like in the olden days, you would have to find a five-pound note in a packet of crisps. I wonder if it was something like inside one of our sandwiches will be, like, the golden lettuce leaf, and if you find it... then you win. I mean, he tried 13 times, but didn't quite make it.
Tom:
That's, A: really good idea for a contest. B: thank you for the sudden punch in the nostalgia from the Walkers Crisps five pound might be in your packet competition.
James:
Yeah.
Tom:
And the magical moment at one school lunchtime, where someone opened a packet and found a fiver inside.
John:
Yeah.
Jonny:
Amazing.
James:
It was so good 'cause it was actual five pound notes! It wasn't like, "Collect these vouchers and do this." It was in the little blue packet, I think.
Tom:
Yeah! And they—
James:
And you just rip it open. But I used to go into the news agents and look. You could kind of see.
Tom:
(laughs)
John:
Did you have a little feel of the packet?
Tom:
Crisp fondling.
James:
Yeah, and have a feel and go, "This doesn't feel like a Quaver. Is it there?"
Jonny:
And I used to go in and buy all these crisps that were just smashed to smithereens and wonder why. 'Cause James had been in there previously...
SFX:
(others laughing)
Jonny:
smashing them all up trying to find a fiver.
Tom:
Not unfortunately a contest.
James:
30— was it 28? I don't know why my brain's gone to this. Is that around the time of... kind of bootlegging and gangsters and...
Tom:
Yes. Yes, and there is a very specific reason for those bootlegging and gangsters in that era.
James:
Yeah. Wow, prohibition, maybe.
Tom:
Prohibition, yes.
James:
That's what I was— and so is it something to do with... They came away disappointed. Were they hoping to find... Was it like a sandwich that had an alcohol name in it or something that they were hoping to get a little bit tipsy from or they'd read that if you... if you ate 18 olives then you would get drunk or something?
Tom:
The famous drunken sandwich soaked in...
SFX:
(group laughing)
James:
Wow! That's why he was disappointed!
John:
Is it some sort of code? Is there— is the— the number of sandwiches related to the code or what— which sandwiches they happen to be? One of those two things that was related to an order that might go in, perhaps?
Tom:
Consider the word 'suddenly'.
John:
Mm.
Tom:
A patron of a Chicago bar suddenly ordered and ate 13 sandwiches.
Jonny:
Oh, so I'm guessing is he trying to hide something?
James:
Oh. Wait, oh! Oh! I got— oh! Yeah, is it that you were only allowed to order food with drinks, and they'd ordered a large quantity of drinks, and so had to order food for it to be with a meal?
Tom:
No. You couldn't legally order alcohol at all. Alcohol was illegal in the US in 1928.
Jonny:
So is he trying to hide something... from, you know, an inspector or the police or someone that was coming in?
Tom:
Yes. Yes, absolutely.
James:
Ohhh!
John:
Get a big old pile of sandwiches out. Barricade yourself in a 13-sandwich wall.
Jonny:
So did he know someone in the bar, and was he trying to protect the person in the bar, or was he the bootlegger?
Tom:
He was trying to protect everyone involved, yes.
John:
So he's ordering 13 sandwiches like the— this is, like, 911. The effect of, you know, "This is an emergency. Hide everything."
Tom:
You know what? That is close enough. I think I'm gonna give it to you. 'Cause I think the exact chain of events here is so precise that I'm gonna say that's close enough. Speakeasies and bars often disguised their activities. Patrons needed plausible reasons for having money on the counter if the authorities arrived, and food purchases were a convenient reason for that to happen. A Chicago bar patron had placed two dollar bills on the counter intending to buy alcohol, when agents entered. When asked what he planned to buy with the money, he quickly ordered sandwiches instead, and to maintain the story, proceeded to eat all 13 of them.
James:
Wow.
John:
Good effort.
Tom:
Despite his efforts, why did he leave disappointed?
Jonny:
Because he didn't get his booze.
Tom:
He didn't get his booze, and the agents still searched the bar anyway.
John:
Oh!
James:
(laughs)
Tom:
The newspaper article about this report said, "The man said in a rather stifled voice, 'I think this will hold me until supper.'"
SFX:
(guests laughing)
John:
Oh, still had a sense of humour. What a man. (chuckles)
Tom:
Each of our guests has brought a question along with them and as happens with our quiz podcast friends, they have written the questions themselves so we will start today with James Smales.
James:
The Italian idiom 'parlare a vanvera' refers to the vanvera, a wearable leather pouch from the 17th century. In what way did this device foster civility? I'll say that again. The Italian idiom 'parlare a vanvera' refers to the vanvera, a wearable leather pouch from the 17th century. In what way did this device foster civility? And this question is a lot harder because I'm not sure I've pronounced any of those words correctly.
Tom:
But I appreciate you not going full Italian stereotype. I respect your choices there. That's better.
Jonny:
Do any of us speak any Italian? First question.
Tom:
No, but parlare sounds like parlay, or speak.
John:
Yeah, speak. Yeah.
Tom:
So I'm thinking it's just, "Speak to Vera," who is someone— she's just called Vera and she's over there.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Jonny:
Speak.
John:
Have a chat with Vera.
Tom:
Yeah, yeah. Or, "Talk to the hand." Like, "Talk to my leather pouch." Which doesn't foster civility but... Also, in my head the leather pouch is like a sporran, and honestly, "Talk to my sporran" is— it's just very rude.
John:
Yeah. That feels like a mild insult, doesn't it? (laughs)
James:
That is all very true, Tom, what you said.
Tom:
Oh.
John:
Speaking to a pouch?
James:
Well, what would happen if you did?
Jonny:
Speak to the— what's in the vanvera? Money?
John:
Hopes and dreams of a nation.
Tom:
(laughs)
James:
If you get that... you've got the answer, Jonny.
Jonny:
Bananas. A puppy. Let's just keep—
SFX:
(group laughing)
Tom:
Money. Money. Talk to my money. I— Again, this is all not civil. Uh, like...
John:
Oh, is it, like, spice? That kind of thing? That's the sort of thing you might keep in a pouch rather than—
Jonny:
Something green? Is— You know, "ver" is green in a lot of those languages. Is anything green?
Tom:
Ooh.
Jonny:
Spi— like you're saying, like, spices or herbs or...
John:
A spice green. Cardamom pods. You'd say they're green.
Tom:
Ooh! Or a weapon. If you're in 17th century Italy and you have a leather pouch, perhaps there is a sword in it. Perhaps your scabbard or...
John:
Well, was it gunpowder?
James:
When you know what the answer is, what you guys are saying is really quite funny but...
SFX:
(group laughing)
Jonny:
Well, how'd it foster civility? 'Cause, yeah, talk to the— talk to the hand or whatever... In our equivalent is rude, isn't it? So civility— is it something to do with police or something like that?
John:
I was gonna say more like breaking bread. That kind of thing. Is there, like, that kind of thing within a pouch? I brought my loaf of bread. We'll break bread together. Let's all be chums.
James:
(chuckles) Sorry, it's just very— again, I— (snickers)
SFX:
(group laughing)
James:
So why would you need to foster civility? Should I tell you a bit more about the device?
Tom:
Yeah. Yeah.
James:
So the device was worn under clothing.
John:
Oh, so I guess you might want to foster civility to— if there wasn't civility in the first place or if you wanted to trade or if you wanted to, you know... Make friends with your neighbors.
James:
I guess another way of saying "foster civility" could be to help avoid embarrassment.
Tom:
Okay, I'm going back to the sporran positioning here and saying that this is like a jock strap or something like that 'cause it's— it's designed to keep— to keep things where they're supposed to be. Don't— That's an incredible face, for those watching in video, and the fact that you're stuttering so much about the suggestion that things are being kept in place— I'm worried about this answer now.
James:
Well, I'm almost— I almost wanna say it's... The complete opposite of what you just said. It doesn't keep things where it's supposed to be.
Tom:
It keeps them where they're not supposed to be.
John:
Yeah. Get— Gets them out and about.
James:
No, it doesn't, John.
John:
Oh, okay.
James:
(laughs) So, it... It dealt with a common bodily function.
Jonny:
Oh. Is it like the equivalent of, like, a nappy or something like that?
James:
Kind of. What— Maybe this... You might need it a stage before that.
Jonny:
Is it for sort of... To prolong drinking sessions? You can— You'd have to get up from the— from the table so you wear something?
Tom:
This is 17th-century Italy or Rome, did you say?
James:
So, the Italian phrase refers to the vanvera – "parlare a vanvera..." You kind of got that parlare means to speak.
Tom:
Is it the Italian equivalent of talking out of your ass?
James:
Yes, Tom! It is!
John:
Oh, wow.
James:
So, so what could the vanvera... (wheezes) be, and what—
John:
Is it like Jonny said, a little nappy or a little stopper of some description, shall we say?
James:
No.
Jonny:
Does it stifle noises?
John:
And what noise might it stifle, Jonny?
Jonny:
Oh, perhaps one that you might emit from behind to— and you don't wanna be embarrassed about it.
James:
(laughs)
Jonny:
Is it literally a muffler for your bottom?
James:
(laughs)
Jonny:
A silencer, yeah.
John:
A silencer.
James:
(laughs) It is!
John:
Amazing.
Tom:
200-something episodes and this is our first question that is a fart joke. Incredible.
SFX:
(group laughing)
James:
It's really made me laugh the whole way through. Everything you've been saying, and like, "Breaking bread". Well, you're not breaking that. You're breaking something else.
SFX:
(Tom and James laugh)
John:
At some point I said, "Cardamom pods." Yes, yeah. For—
Tom:
At some point I suggested sticking a sword in it and—
SFX:
(group laughing)
James:
So I think we've got most of it. It what way did it foster civility?
John:
I guess it was rude, wasn't it? To make noises that no one wanted to hear.
James:
So what did the pouch do?
John:
Pretend— Prevented you from doing that or at least mitigated them.
Jonny:
Oh, did it also— I mean, if it didn't do this, but I would suggest they would upgrade— Did it have sort of herbs and things in to disguise smells?
James:
I don't think there were herbs, no. So the vanvera trapped the sounds and smells of flatulence.
Jonny:
What, and you could let them out— let them out later on when you get home?
James:
Exactly that! So the vanvera was a small leather pouch worn against the body, reportedly intended to muffle the sound and contain the smell of flatulence during social situations in early modern Italy. And once the wearer had privacy again, the pouch could be emptied. And the Italian expression "parlare a vanvera" now means to talk nonsense or to speak without thinking. Like the— Like you said, "Talk out your ass," Tom. The phrase is thought to evoke the idea of something empty or meaningless coming out, much like the device associated with controlling an embarrassing bodily noise.
John:
Amazing work.
Tom:
This question was sent in by an anonymous listener. "Something that has saved countless lives dates back "to 1911, when Edward Hines was driving behind a faulty tanker. What idea did this inspire?" I'll say that again. "Something that has saved countless lives "dates back to 1911, "when Edward Hines was driving behind a faulty tanker. What idea did this inspire?"
James:
Oh, Edward Hines, as in the beans man?
Tom:
(laughs)
John:
The beansman?
James:
Yeah!
Tom:
H-I-N-E-S.
James:
Ah. Different guy.
Jonny:
Faulty tanker.
John:
Saved countless— It's not gonna be the obvious stuff. What would a faulty tanker—
Jonny:
Exactly. So it's sort of like— or you're— or you're looking at it and you're... You know, the chassis's broken which means it's— it's moving more freely or it's something like that and he's thought, "Oh, that's tanker's broken. "It's doing that, but if I applied that to something else, it may well be useful."
James:
It won't be a car tanker, though, will it? Is it 1911? Weren't the first kind of commercial cars only in, like, the early 19— like, the Model T Ford was, like, early 1900s. Is it an oil tanker? Or like a boat, maybe?
John:
I would think some— it's some road driving device that was carrying oil, petrol, whatever. You know, fuel.
James:
And, you know, like those— is it the guy who stuck his hair in tights and— and mopped up oil? I remember seeing that on a "Blue Peter" episode once.
Tom:
(stammering) Sorry, the what?
James:
(laughs) There was a "Blue Peter" episode where there was— must have been an oil spill when I was a child and they were talking about the environmental disaster but if everyone from the barber's... They got lots of hair, you stuffed them in tights, and then took them out to the ocean and it soaked up all the oil to save the wildlife.
Tom:
That all makes sense. The only question I have is that you did originally say "his hair" which implies just a lot of— of hair from one person which is slightly confusing.
John:
Oh, I thought he was putting them on his head and rubbing his head on the oil.
Tom:
Yeah, that's what I was thinking.
John:
That was the image that was conjured in my mind.
Tom:
Yeah.
James:
(laughing)
John:
Well, I guess cars in 1911 were pretty basic, right? They, you know— they were four wheels and not a lot else.
James:
Yeah, tanker.
John:
So, I mean, anything's a safety improvement pretty much on that.
Tom:
Yes. Yes it's—
Jonny:
So that's it. Was Edward Hines following something in a car? What was it he was following? A tank— A faulty tanker. What are the safety devices a car has? Airbag, seat belt, and... auto braking.
John:
I think we've gotta be thinking more basic than that. Are we thinking, like, oil tanker has... Oil tanker has spillage of some description or it's going down a muddy lane and kicking up a load of muck. And he's drivin' there. He's got his little window in front of him and he's all of a sudden, "I can't see a thing." He has to poke his head out the side. Would windscreen wipers be helpful at this point in time? Yes, they would. And Edward Hines thought, "Know what I'll do? I'll pop a couple screen wipers on."
Tom:
We are talking something that basic, yes.
John:
Okay.
James:
Oh. I wonder if it's an indicator. Do cars have indicators before this time?
John:
They just used the hands, didn't they? Pop the hand out? "I'll go that way."
James:
Or has it lights? Was it too— the fact of turning both your indicators on to stop?
Tom:
You have all focused on safety features on the car.
Jonny:
So is it a safety feature on the— it's— for me it's the tanker. Is— Are we on the right lines of thinking it is a big oil tanker? 'Cause like you were saying, James, were they even around in that time?
Tom:
Not oil.
Jonny:
Milk?
James:
Beer?
Tom:
Milk.
Jonny:
Is it to do with pasteurisation?
John:
Oh, wow.
Jonny:
Maybe it was milk curdling. Churning around, becoming butter. If it's faulty... Or is it the way that— maybe it's how it's sort of moving. I'm moving now swaying side to side and he noticed that the milk doesn't—
James:
Yeah, what fault would a milk tanker have that you would see?
Jonny:
'Cause if it's rigid, maybe the milk churns around but if something's broken and it's moving more loosely, does that allow liquid to move with more of a flowing method and it means tankers aren't tipping up anymore or something like that? Would tankers tip up if they were rigid?
Tom:
John, I think you said, "What fault would a milk tanker have?" And if you figure that out, the rest will fall into place very quickly.
John:
My brain is now going towards refrigeration. And that kind of thing. 'Cause ref— that's the vague place where fridges became, you know, not quite then, but more commercially available later. Is it— it'd be hard to see that, though, wouldn't it, I guess?
Jonny:
I think I've had a brain wave.
James:
Go on, Jonny.
Jonny:
It might not be right. I've had a— if the milk—
Tom:
Oh, is— the confidence was there and then it's evap— Own this one, Jonny! Own this one. Be confident.
Jonny:
Okay, okay. I'm driving. I'm driving behind the milk.
John:
You got this.
Jonny:
There's a small hole in the bottom of the milk tanker and it's dropping a white line down the middle of the road. And that's—
Tom:
There is.
James:
Oh!
Jonny:
It's the idea that if I drive on this side and everyone else drives on the opposite side, we will stop crashing head-first into each other.
John:
Oh, Jonny.
Tom:
Edward Hines was the chairman of the Wayne County Board of Roads in Michigan. He was driving behind a milk truck with a leaking tank creating this long, continuous trail down the road. Hines realised that a permanent white line could separate opposing lanes of traffic, prevent head-on collisions which were becoming increasingly common. The first documented use of a white line in the middle of the road appeared that same year on River Road in Trenton, Michigan. Uh, there were other places far behind. I'm sure there were other simultaneous inventions close, but this is one of the earliest-known implementations of a center line in the road.
James:
Wow.
John:
Great catch, Jonny.
Tom:
Great catch.
Jonny:
Love me some milk.
Tom:
Jonny, we will go to you next.
Jonny:
The Lehe Ledu Liangjiang Holiday Hotel in Yongchuan, China has a business centre with high-speed internet. Firefox facilities are provided to guests only in the mornings. Why does this please customers? The Lehe Ledu Liangjiang Holiday Hotel in Yongchuan, China has a business centre with high-speed internet. Firefox facilities are provided to guests only in the mornings. Why does this please customers?
James:
Jonny, can you have one go at saying it really quickly? The place names?
Jonny:
Lehe Ledu Liangjiang Holiday Hotel in Yongchuan, China.
James:
Okay, that makes more sense.
Jonny:
You see? You've— Yeah. Yeah.
James:
Yeah, I know where that is.
John:
Got it. Yeah. I'm not even gonna attempt to announce that.
Tom:
No. I'm going to assume that the hotel name is not relevant to this question.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Tom:
And Jonny could have just said, "There's a hotel in a city in China."
Jonny:
But where's the fun in that?
John:
Yeah. I like your commitment to it, Jonny.
James:
But I wonder if maybe the location matters. Could it be in... Macau... in China where it's kind of famous for gambling? And is it some kind of... play on a kind of... internet poker or something where they're able to connect to the internet to kind of gamble?
Tom:
Am I the only person here who knows what Firefox is?
James:
No, Firefox, the browser.
Tom:
The browser, right?
John:
Yeah.
Tom:
Yeah, I'm just like— okay.
John:
The browser, yeah.
Tom:
I'm just checking that I want— checking that it hasn't become so obscure that my, like—
SFX:
(group laughing)
Tom:
My early 21st century web knowledge had fallen out of use.
James:
(cackles)
John:
(chuckles)
James:
But I wonder if it's in China, and it's Firefox, is there a particular kind of software that they'd need to run that... Let's say it was internet poker that allowed them to play a particular game with people in America that opened at a certain time or for sports betting to do with, like, the Premier League, and that's in the morning... in China, maybe.
John:
I was— So I've gone a completely different route to the two of you in my brain. I've thought, is this hotel part zoo, and they've got nocturnal creatures or at least creatures that are most active in the morning, and they, you know, they have windows or a viewing platform or something that allay— enables people to see something that is called the Firefox – this mystery animal – rather than the browser?
Tom:
I've gone a third route which is that this isn't about web browsing. It's about Firefox specifically. So maybe there are other browsers there. There is Google Chrome. There is Edge. There's other options. And Firefox sounds like it might be something to do with the Chinese zodiac. It is an element and a creature, but I don't know if there is a year of the fox.
James:
Oh, no, there isn't.
Tom:
Ah, okay.
James:
I don't think. I'm saying that with confidence. We've asked quite a lot of Chinese zodiac questions.
John:
You went big there, Jim, with your confidence. (laughs)
James:
I'm gonna say no, and I'll take the angry comments.
Jonny:
So, John, you are on the... the most correct lines there, I would say.
James:
What, a zoo?!
John:
I've got a note to myself just to say the silliest thing, and I'm— I've fully committed to it by saying the silliest thing.
SFX:
(others laughing)
John:
It's reaping rewards.
James:
Is there an animal that is... more active in the morning? A fire fox?
John:
Is there— Is "fire fox" a different name for something? So something isn't— It's not a— 'Cause I can't think of an animal that's ever called a fire fox, but that might be... a nickname a particular animal has, maybe.
James:
Or, like, they need the internet to see cameras in the burrows?
John:
Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah.
James:
And in the morning—
John:
Live zoo. Live zoo feeds. You have that for various zoos.
James:
Yeah.
Tom:
I don't think there's a real creature called a fire fox. 'Cause Firefox the browser was originally called Phoenix, and then they had a trademark dispute, and they changed the animal, but still made it on fire.
John:
Well, why not?
James:
(laughs heartily)
Tom:
'Cause it was rising from the ashes of another browser that had been abandoned, but... I don't think there's an actual fire fox, but I could be wrong.
James:
A fox on fire isn't as majestic as a phoenix, is it?
SFX:
(group laughing)
John:
No, no.
James:
I'll just go and help it.
Tom:
I don't know. I think—
James:
Put it out.
Tom:
I think of a flaming fox walks through London, you know, just— just on fi— (stammers)
James:
Yeah.
Jonny:
So Tom, and... there is an animal that is known as a fire fox, but maybe if you can sort of work out what they're doing with these animals, and then that might help you land on what the animal is, but you know, you don't have to get there straight away.
James:
Oh. If it's a business hotel, and you see it in the morning, like, are you looking for your lunch? Is it like—
Tom:
(cracks up)
James:
You're looking to choose, like, a lobster and you— in the morning you wake up and you say, "Right, I want that—"
John:
I get it, yeah.
James:
"for our lunchtime meeting, and we'll eat the fire fox."
Jonny:
You're not. You're not eating the fire fox. You might be eating with the fi—
John:
Is it feeding the fire fox?
Jonny:
You're so close. You might be eating at the same time there, to give you a big clue.
John:
Oh, can you go— is it like a place— a restaurant where the animals are in there with you, whatever this animal might be? I imagine therefore quite a small creature, not a massive one. And it can come and pick your food, or you can feed it or it's more of an experience together.
Tom:
You said that guests were happy that this was only in the mornings, right?
Jonny:
Yes, that's correct.
Tom:
Fire fox service. Hold on. Fire fox— service can be... a word for being waited on. For the staff. Are the staff at the breakfast tables fire foxes? Like, they send them out with packs on or something like that for the tables so you can... I don't know how this works!
SFX:
(guests laughing)
Tom:
I'm just seeing whatever this fire fox is in a little tux and a dickie bow to...
Jonny:
You're so, so close.
James:
Tom, if it's not the answer, we've got a new business.
Jonny:
I'll give you a big sort of hint 'cause you are so close, so without just giving it to you straight out. If you are going to sleep in a hotel, what— why might you phone up reception the night before you go to sleep and ask them to do?
Tom:
A wake-up call. Or maybe, like, room service breakfast.
Jonny:
A wake-up call is correct.
Tom:
Do they wake you up with the howling of a fire fox?
Jonny:
So, you've not landed on the animal. I will give you the answer. They wake you up, they do a morning wake-up service at this hotel with fire foxes that are also known as red pandas. That is the fire fox.
John:
Of course, a red panda.
James:
Oh, yeah. Of course it is!
Jonny:
So they wake you up. The red pandas – or the fire foxes – come into your room, they climb onto your bed, and they wander around. What a lovely way to wake up in the morning.
Tom:
Did you say this was a business hotel or just a regular hotel?
Jonny:
This is just a— It's just a regular hotel.
John:
This seems like a regular hotel to me, isn't it?
Tom:
It's a hotel with a business centre. Right, okay.
James:
Oh.
Tom:
Yeah. The business centre is just there as a red herring so I'd spend far too long talking about browsers.
Jonny:
Exactly. The business centre is a red herring.
Tom:
Cool. Yeah.
Jonny:
Which, John—
Tom:
Yeah.
Jonny:
John managed to—
John:
Nicely done.
Jonny:
Like he said, he just thought, "What's the weirdest thing I can say? Maybe fire fox is an animal." As soon as he said that I was like, "I can't believe he's... He's done it. He's sort of nail on the head with that straight away." So yeah. So this hotel offers this. But I must say, the Forestry Bureau have reportedly asked the hotel to cease all of their close contact activities with these animals.
Tom:
Thank you to Steve D. for sending in this question. From the 1600s until quite recently, most children in Western Europe knew that the Bridge was good, the Hotel was bad, and that if they reached a certain place, their goose was cooked. Why? I'll say that again. From the 1600s until quite recently, most children in Western Europe knew that the Bridge was good, the Hotel was bad, and that if they reached a certain place their goose was cooked. Why?
James:
Oh, it sounds like a language thing. Like learning a language, doesn't it? Like, "Ou est la bibliotheque?"
John:
Why would a bridge be good, a hotel be bad, and once you— when you reach a certain place, your goose is cooked?
Tom:
If you can figure any of those out, you might have a good shot at this question.
John:
I don't think I've got a good shot at this.
Tom:
"Why might a bridge be good" is actually one of the hints I've got here.
James:
Oh, wow. The hint's just part of the question again.
SFX:
(group laughing)
James:
The next one is, "Why would a hotel be bad?"
Tom:
Yeah.
James:
And why would a goose be cooked?
Jonny:
"Goose be cooked." It's... Is that just— Are we using that in a specific way? "Your goose is cooked?" Or is it that... Could you also have said, "Or it's game over?"
John:
Game's over.
Jonny:
Or, yeah. You're gonna expire, or something along those lines?
James:
Or it could be a game... Could it?
Tom:
It could be a game. In fact, when someone said, "Game over" there, I flinched a little.
Jonny:
Oh!
Tom:
(laughs)
James:
A game that involves... Bridges, hotels, and gooses. But they're all five-letter words, aren't they? And so—
Tom:
Not necessarily across Western Europe there. Also, Bridge is six letter.
John:
Bridge is a six-letter word.
James:
Oh, yeah. Good.
Jonny:
I don't think it's— it's not gonna be a— it won't be a video game. It's not a video game because obviously they didn't exist in that time. Board games – obviously we're used to playing them now, you know, with bridges and geese and all sorts of things going on. But have there been any games that have been around in that time and are still popular now, like chess or—
John:
Chess, for example, is something that's very popular and has been for a long time but maybe there are some words in there.
Tom:
This is an old board game known from the 17th century until quite recently. So what might the bridge be?
James:
Is it checkers? Bridge? You, like, jump over a piece to take it? Hotel, as in staying where you are is bad or—
Tom:
Hotel is bad because it keeps you where you are. In a more modern version it could be good or bad, but yeah, the hotel keeps you there for a while.
John:
Is it your classic Snakes and Ladders?
Tom:
Yep! It's—
John:
So you'd—
Tom:
It's a roll-and-move game. It is the Game of the Goose which is known across Western Europe less so these days... but it was originated in Italy probably about the 17th century, and this is a spiral track of numbered spaces. You advance by rolling dice and there are spaces with special effects like you said. The hotel, it misses a turn 'cause you're staying at the hotel. What might the bridge be? Why might that be good?
Jonny:
Like, is it like a ladder or skip a space?
Tom:
Yeah, skips you forward. You go on ahead. Um, if you reach a certain place your goose was cooked. What might that be?
Jonny:
Oh, it sort of sounds like an old version of sort of like Mouse Trap where, you know, you've got there and there— the thing has fallen down or the— are you the goose? Are you the goose, or is there...
James:
Yeah, are you a traveller like Dick Whittington and His Cat that you're... Tom Scott and His Goose?
John:
Or is there a go back to start? That kind of square on the game?
Tom:
It's a go back to start. It is the Death Square, represented by a cooked goose, sends you all the way back to the start.
James:
(groans)
Tom:
The game was so widespread and so simple, many editions were sold without printed rules because children were just expected to know how to play.
Jonny:
That's a— That's our next board game night sorted.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Tom:
John, over to you.
John:
After going around in circles for a long time, an item was purchased from a warehouse in Scottsboro, Alabama, even though it was clearly intended for someone else. It later became a coffee table. What was the item? I'll say it again. After going around in circles for a long time, an item was purchased from a warehouse in Scottsboro, Alabama, even though it was clearly intended for someone else. It later became a coffee table. What was the item?
Tom:
Sorry, folks, I'm stepping back. I did not get permission to film at that place, but I know what it is.
Jonny:
Oh?
John:
Oh!
James:
Oh, wow! I feel like I've heard of Scottsboro, Alabama, but... I don't know why. Would— Is it famous for this thing, maybe?
Jonny:
It was clearly intended for someone else. Now, that has, like, sort of sinister connotations when I hear that. Like, you know what I mean? Like, when, like, a bullet or a bomb or something has got, "Right, I'm gonna write your name on it. This is for you."
James:
The thing that's got me is going around in circles. I thought of, like, a baggage carousel. And that would be intended for someone else, because it would be their luggage.
Tom:
I mean, good news, James. You've caught up to me at this point. If John's nodding...
James:
Oh!
John:
(nods)
Tom:
That's the location. Well, that's the start of it, yeah.
Jonny:
Is it where people buy lost luggage? You know, you always see it, don't you, online where people go, "I bought this suitcase, and let's see what's inside," and, I mean, all you're normally gonna get is, what, people's old pants and socks and sunscreen.
Tom:
Yeah.
Jonny:
But—
Tom:
Mhm.
Jonny:
There was some—
John:
Yep.
Tom:
I once asked to film there, because they've had a few... folks who do fashion and beauty and that kind of haul stuff there. Now, they turned me down. They were very polite about it. They didn't give a reason. They just said, "Not possible". And I suspect that is because I might have asked questions about the province of the luggage and why— and all the details and, you know, complicated stuff about cleaning and privacy before it, which— and I'm not impugning them there. Those are all questions I'm sure they'd be able to answer, but they are questions that they would prefer not to delve into the details of, because ultimately, they are selling lost luggage. And if you put the spin on it that this is lost luggage and not, "Ooh, let's see what we've found," it's not quite as good a PR thing.
Jonny:
Yeah.
James:
Yeah, so wait. Is the selling the lost luggage only this place that does it? Is it not a normal thing?
Tom:
They, I think, have the contracts with all the US airlines to do that.
James:
Oh! Wow.
John:
They do indeed.
Jonny:
I know this has not to do with your question, John, but I'm side barring to get some info from Tom. Do people go and just buy one suitcase just like a lucky dip or do they go and buy, you know, a crate of 100 suitcases to then sell on it?
James:
Oh, like when they buy a storage unit.
Tom:
I— They basically take the suitcase to bits. They will sell the suitcase if it's in good condition. They will sell the contents of the suitcase that might be saleable, and the rest go off to I think donations and charity shops or even recycling and trash if there's nothing else there.
James:
Right. So it was turned in— So the question, John, so we've got the first bit. So the next bit is, "It was turned into a coffee table. What was it?" So it was a piece of luggage that someone turned into a coffee table. So was it a suitcase?
Jonny:
Was it anything illegal? Was it illegal?
John:
It wasn't illegal. No, no.
Jonny:
So it wasn't like smuggling something or anything like that.
John:
No, nothing illegal.
Jonny:
So it's got their name on it.
John:
I'd keep on going down that route, yeah.
James:
It's not just a suitcase.
Jonny:
No, but the thing— I think the thing inside the suitcase... was intended for someone else. So it's got their name on it.
Tom:
This is anything that isn't picked up from baggage carousels or gets lost by the airline. So the airlines will try to get it to the right person, but if the bag has lost its tag and doesn't have anything inside identifying the owner, and no one calls up saying, "I've got this exact bag that's been lost," then it ends up with them after, like— This is in the contract of carriage with the airlines. That's how they're legally able to do it.
John:
I think the word – the most operative word you used, Tom, was 'anything' there.
Tom:
Yeah, 'cause it's not just suitcases.
Jonny:
Once again I'm gonna do— I'm gonna go and say I've got it. I've got a bold idea.
SFX:
(James and John guffaw)
John:
Go for it, Jonny.
Jonny:
A coffee table requires legs. Is this someone's prosthetic leg that they've bought and turned into a coffee table?
Tom:
(gasps)
John:
Not quite. No. It's not prosthetic legs, no.
Jonny:
Ooh!
James:
Ooh.
Jonny:
Ooh.
James:
Well, not quite. A prosthetic arm?
John:
No, not. It's just not prosthetic legs.
Tom:
No, there's no way they'd do this. There's no way they'd do this. Is this— How dark is the answer to this question? How dark is the answer to this question?
James:
(wheezes)
John:
Keep going, Tom. Keep going!
Tom:
I don't want this to be the case.
John:
(guffaws)
Tom:
Is this a coffin?
John:
Ooh, you're circ— you're very close.
Tom:
Okay, I'm glad it's not a coffin because the coffin could have been, like, a thing, or it could have been the coffin that a body was in, and the body wasn't claimed.
Jonny:
Yeah.
Tom:
And someone resold the coffin. That was how dark I was thinking with that. Okay, no.
James:
Oh, so ashes, like, in an urn.
John:
Not quite the right size for a coffee table, I would say.
Jonny:
So it's not an urn. It's not a coffee— It's not a prosthetic limb. We've all had a good go there at... the weirdest things we could think of.
SFX:
(group laughing)
James:
But is there a clue in the question as to what this thing is? I can't work— We just kind of—
John:
No, I think you— you've— you're very close with your train of thought. I would suggest that it's— it wasn't difficult to convert into a coffee table.
Jonny:
Well, a coffee table is, what, sort of— it's wooden, normally. It's flat. Sort of square or oblong or round. It's not a coffin. We know that.
John:
Coffee tables can be made from many things. Not all of them wood or glass.
Jonny:
Metal?
John:
And other things.
Jonny:
Or, like, ivory. Ivory or something like that.
John:
Ivory?
James:
Iron?
Jonny:
Marble? What else do you make a coffee table out of?
John:
Think— Keep thinking along those lines. Not quite marble.
James:
Oh! Was it, like, a stone from— that was being sent to a museum like stone— or Stonehenge?
Tom:
It's not a coffin. It's a headstone.
Jonny:
Ahhh!
John:
It's a headstone. That's exactly it.
James:
Oh, of course!
John:
It was a f— It was a fully-engraved headstone that turned up in unclaimed luggage at the lost and found facility, and after going unclaimed, it was sold and later converted into a coffee table.
Jonny:
Amazing.
Tom:
Wow!
SFX:
(group laughing)
John:
Jonny, when you said "sinister" really early on, I thought, "Oh, he's got this immediately!"
Jonny:
Yeah, no. I just thought...
Tom:
(laughs)
Jonny:
I'm gonna go look for a prosthetic leg coffee table now. That's gonna be... next to Tom's coffin one.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Tom:
So all we have left is CJ Neale's question from the start of the show. In 2011, why did a hall of fame put 15 pounds of beef jerky on display? Anyone want to take a quick shot at that?
James:
Yeah, is it Ian Botham for the Cricket Hall of Fame? He was called Beefy Botham.
Tom:
Oh! Uh, no. Good connection. Good sports knowledge. Wrong genre of hall of fame. And it's more literal than that.
Jonny:
Is it the Baseball Hall of Fame?
John:
Is Beef Jerky a nickname for someone? That's... Someone's hand prints. Nickname's Beef Jerky.
Tom:
You will almost certainly have seen pictures of this beef jerky before.
Jonny:
Oh.
John:
Oh, no.
James:
It— oh! Was it Lady Gaga's meat dress?
Tom:
It was Lady Gaga's meat dress!
John:
Jim, well done.
Tom:
Spot on, James!
John:
Beautifully done.
Tom:
Well done. She wore it to the 2010 MTV Video Music Awards. The Rock & Roll Hall of Fame wanted to display the dress, but due to the use of perishable items, it had to be preserved as jerky first.
SFX:
(guests giggling)
John:
That's amazing.
Tom:
Since 2019, it is in the Haus of Gaga Museum at the Park MGM Casino in Las Vegas. Thank you very much to all of our players. Plug the podcast. Plug what you do. We'll start with John.
John:
So, we got Here's What You Do. We have a new podcast that comes out every Wednesday. We send one another three brand new quizzes every single week. No two quizzes are the same let alone episodes. Come and give us a listen.
Tom:
Jonny, where can people find you?
Jonny:
They can find us everywhere you find podcasts. We're on Spotify, we're on all the socials, we're on Instagram, we're on TikTok. Just search for "Here's What You Do", and you're bound to stumble upon us somewhere.
Tom:
And James, there is a side podcast as well?
James:
Yes, we release the main pod on a Wednesday, but on a Monday we do Here's What You Missed, where we do all the behind-the-scenes of how we wrote the quizzes, tiebreakers, plus we'll also explain how we wrote our
Tom:
Lateral
James:
questions today.
Tom:
And if you want to know more about this show, you can do that at lateralcast.com, where you can also send in your own ideas for questions and join the Lateral Producer's Club. We are at @lateralcast basically everywhere, and there are full episodes in video every week on Spotify. Thank you very much to James Smales.
James:
Thank you!
Tom:
Jonny Robins.
Jonny:
Cheers, bye!
Tom:
John Cantrell.
John:
Thank you.
Tom:
I've been Tom Scott, and that's been Lateral.
Episode Credits
| HOST | Tom Scott |
| QUESTION PRODUCER | David Bodycombe |
| EDITED BY | Julie Hassett at The Podcast Studios, Dublin |
| MUSIC | Karl-Ola Kjellholm ('Private Detective'/'Agrumes', courtesy of epidemicsound.com) |
| ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS | James Smales, Jonny Robins, John Cantrell, C.J. Neale, Chris Howlett, Steve Dee |
| FORMAT | Pad 26 Limited/Labyrinth Games Ltd |
| EXECUTIVE PRODUCERS | David Bodycombe and Tom Scott |